[App_rpt-users] External Controller Plus Allstar

Sun Apr 13 11:08:52 UTC 2014

Let me see if I have this sorted out. If we ditch the RC-210's we can vote.
We can add simple URI's to bring in a WX receiver, IRLP, possibly a RF link?
Also, when I referred to remote base I was referring to a control link. We
don't want people listening to the input :-) I just want simple.

Can RC-210's be resold?

  _____  

From: Tim Sawyer [mailto:tim.sawyer at mac.com] 
Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2014 7:51 AM
To: Wayne
Cc: app_rpt mailing list
Subject: Re: [App_rpt-users] External Controller Plus Allstar

I forgot to address your remote base requirement. RTCMs do not support
remote bases. You will need a computer and URI where the remote base is. But
check to see if you radio is supported. Allstar doesn't support many.

--

Tim

:wq

On Apr 12, 2014, at 7:37 AM, Tim Sawyer <tim.sawyer at mac.com> wrote:

So the way a voter a voter works is it samples the noise (like squelch does)
on each receiver and then takes the signal with the least noise and sends it
to the transmitter. If you have a controller in front of the RTCM the
controller will always be sending the receiver to the transmitter even if
the signal has noise. 

RTCMs are just smart IO devices. Think of them as not being much different
than a sound FOB on the end of an ethernet cable. Generally, with RTCMs, the
computer will be at some central location on the ground and the RTCMs will
be far away on a high hill or tower. 

In your case, because your IP network is only between your two hills, the
computer will be at one site or the other. So wherever the computer is
located, is where you would connect in your IRLP box with a URI or other
sound FOB. Echolink could be on that same (or a different) box. Echolink is
a app that runs on the Allstar computer no sound FOB or URI required. 

It really comes down to this: you either use Allstar or you don't. The other
issue you've not touched on yet it touch tone commands. Trying to work out a
scheme where the RC-210 commands and the Allstar commands don't conflict is
difficult and confusing for your users. 

My recommendation is to save the RC-210s for another project. Put RTCM's on
your three hills connected directly to the repeaters. Put the Allstar
computer on the ground on your IP network. Get 5 Allstar nodes: Use one node
for the voting system of Site 1 and 2. Use another node for site 3. Use a
node for the IRLP URI. Use a node for Echolink. That way you have the most
flexibility while using the lease amount of hardware and having a clean TT
command structure. 

--

Tim

:wq

On Apr 12, 2014, at 4:53 AM, Wayne <wayne at anywherehost.net> wrote:

One more thought, if I may. How do voted systems bring in IRLP or EchoLink?
Aren't we talking about something similar? I'm really bummed now.

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From: KJ6KO [mailto: <mailto:kj6ko at innercite.com> kj6ko at innercite.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 9:57 PM
To: Wayne
Subject: Re: [App_rpt-users] External Controller Plus Allstar

Well, I don't know how much help I can be here.  I don't use voting, don't
like it, never will, but that's me.  Trying to combine a voted system of
RTCM's into a regular RF link may be interesting.  Not sure how the RTCM
will react to a "link" input as it is used to discriminator input as far as
know.

There are people more familiar with RTCM's voting and simulcasting than I am
that may be able to help you. 

I use URI's and have just connected them directly to controller ports, like
you would a link radio, and they work and sound great!  I have even used
them as the controller and sound even better!

Sorry I can't be much more help than that!

good luck and 73 de Greg

----- Original Message -----

From: Wayne <mailto:wayne at anywherehost.net> 

To: 'app_rpt <mailto:app_rpt-users at ohnosec.org>  mailing list'

Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 8:05 PM

Subject: Re: [App_rpt-users] External Controller Plus Allstar

Hi Greg,

Thank you for taking the time to reply.

Our operational goal is a hybrid system that is voted and simulcast between
two repeaters 100 miles apart but overlapping input coverage. They have no
LOS. Site 1 and 2 are on a VLAN provided by the site vendor but Site 3 only
has wireless internet. We will be using a RF link. We don't want to use the
public internet.

Each location will also have a remote base and a WX receiver with a FIPS
code for that area only. Using some switching logic we will disconnect from
Allstar if the WX receiver triggers. No need to send marine weather alerts
to the desert.

The topology expected is Site 1 -> Site 2 (Allstar; voted), Site 1 -> Site 3
(RF link; different frequency). Since it isn't our VLAN we can't use
Ubiquity or similar to link to Site 3 as an unvoted device. There is also
significant overlap of outputs but I sure would love to be voted and have
only one pair. That would be so nice. We already have RC-210's so we don't
want to toss them aside and buy RTCM's as just controllers as has been
suggested. We will end up with RTCM's for the voting ($$$) and the RC-210's
for control. Using the RC-210's allows us cell phone access to the RC-210's
as well as through the remote bases.

As you probably know the RC-210's have a 4th port that is no frills. The WX
receivers can go on this "port".

  _____  

From: KJ6KO [mailto: <mailto:kj6ko at innercite.com> kj6ko at innercite.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 12:48 PM
To: Wayne
Subject: Re: [App_rpt-users] External Controller Plus Allstar

Wayne, I think what we need is to figure out what exactly you are trying to
do.

  If you are running a full simulcast/voted system, (multiple transmitters,
multiple receivers with ALL receivers and transmitters connected via
Allstar)  and want a backup RF link, you will need 3 total ports.  1 for the
repeater, 1 for the backup RF link and 1 for the RTCM.  Just treat the RTCM
like a "Link Radio" as that is basically what it is.

  Since you are new to allstar, I assume that is not the case. 

If you are just trying to connect your repeater or repeater system to
Allstar, a RTCM is serious overkill!  I would recommend a DMK URI for 1/4
the price.  You can even use it as the controller and eliminate your current
unit!  It will still run as a standalone repeater when offline.

Does that help?

Let us know what you have and what you would like to do and we could
probably be more help.

73 de Greg  KJ6KO

----- Original Message -----

From: Wayne <mailto:wayne at anywherehost.net> 

To: 'app_rpt <mailto:app_rpt-users at ohnosec.org>  mailing list'

Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 9:48 AM

Subject: Re: [App_rpt-users] External Controller Plus Allstar

".If you mean you want to parallel app_rpt/allstar with a existing hardwired
controller, you will need to use "DUPLEX=0 & LINKTOLINK=YES" on the primary
node for that/each location.  It will give you the same fullduplex but with
no hang time etc that you can parallel with existing controller. A port on
your rc-210 if i remember them correct."

I sincerely appreciate the answer but as I mentioned I am new to Allstar. As
such I don't know how to ask the question. I received this reply and
appreciate the time it took to write. But I wonder if another user can offer
insight into wiring. Do I wire the Allstar device to Port 1 and then the
repeater to port 2? Do I keep the option of voted simulcast? Doing so only
leaves one port remaining. Am I missing something in the translation here?
Thank you. I appreciate your time.

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