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    How would apt-pinning effect the issues. Other then people updating
    their kernel without thought to the fact that the kernel headers are
    needed to re-compile. Debian 8 is current and security updates
    happen all the time. <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 7/11/2016 2:18 PM, Loren Tedford
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAK=eTyhnwfKW0d+9t8+_EZuKLhmkE4=tSs549j6CXPCeSTynoQ@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">Steve any idea how far we have gotten?? The
        security threat list is pretty large at the moment..
        <div><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-6284/Asterisk.html">https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-6284/Asterisk.html</a><br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
          <div class="gmail_extra">And honestly the above is probably
            for more current versions which mean their are probably more
            threats out their than we really want to think about..</div>
          <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
          </div>
          <div class="gmail_extra">All i know is we can't keep running
            on this version for ever well i don't think we can.. I guess
            we may get to the point of apt pinning.. </div>
          <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
          </div>
          <div class="gmail_extra">While i am being honest here.. We
            should probably one day update the mailing list to more of a
            forum thread some where with actual details etc.. Mailing
            list seems to be abit old school just my thoughts..</div>
          <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
            <div>
              <div class="gmail_signature"
                data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
                <div dir="ltr">
                  <div style="font-size:small;font-family:arial">Loren
                    Tedford (KC9ZHV) </div>
                  <div style="font-size:small;font-family:arial">Phone:</div>
                  <div style="font-size:small"><font face="arial">Fax: </font><br>
                    <font face="arial">Email: </font><a
                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="mailto:lorentedford@gmail.com"
                      style="color:rgb(17,85,204);font-family:arial"
                      target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:lorentedford@gmail.com">lorentedford@gmail.com</a></a></div>
                  <div style="font-size:small">Email: <a
                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="mailto:KC9ZHV@KC9ZHV.com"
                      style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:KC9ZHV@KC9ZHV.com">KC9ZHV@KC9ZHV.com</a></a></div>
                  <div style="font-size:small;font-family:arial"><a
                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="http://www.lorentedford.com/"
                      style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.lorentedford.com">http://www.lorentedford.com</a></a></div>
                  <div style="font-size:small;font-family:arial"><a
                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="http://www.kc9zhv.com/"
                      style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.kc9zhv.com">http://www.kc9zhv.com</a></a></div>
                  <div style="font-size:small;font-family:arial"><a
                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="http://forum.kc9zhv.com/"
                      style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://forum.kc9zhv.com">http://forum.kc9zhv.com</a></a></div>
                  <div style="font-size:small;font-family:arial"><a
                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="http://hub.kc9zhv.com/"
                      style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://hub.kc9zhv.com">http://hub.kc9zhv.com</a></a></div>
                  <div style="font-size:small"><a moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="http://ltcraft.net/"
                      style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank">http://Ltcraft.net<span></span><span></span></a></div>
                </div>
              </div>
            </div>
            <br>
            <div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 1:12 PM,
              Steve Zingman <span dir="ltr"><<a
                  moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:szingman@msgstor.com" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:szingman@msgstor.com">szingman@msgstor.com</a></a>></span>
              wrote:<br>
              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> Time, Energy,
                  drive, people. Just to name a few.
                  <div>
                    <div class="h5"><br>
                      <br>
                      <div>On 7/11/2016 2:08 PM, Loren Tedford wrote:<br>
                      </div>
                      <blockquote type="cite">
                        <div dir="ltr">Ok so what are missing to get the
                          development started on a more current version
                          of asterisk?? Lets face it 1.4.23 went out of
                          professional service back in like 2010...
                          <div><br>
                          </div>
                          <div>Just saying we really need to start
                            thinking more about the future now rather
                            than waiting till we have mass issues across
                            the board.. </div>
                          <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
                            <div>
                              <div data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
                                <div dir="ltr">
                                  <div
                                    style="font-size:small;font-family:arial">Loren

                                    Tedford (KC9ZHV) </div>
                                  <div
                                    style="font-size:small;font-family:arial">Phone:</div>
                                  <div style="font-size:small"><font
                                      face="arial">Fax: </font><br>
                                    <font face="arial">Email: </font><a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:lorentedford@gmail.com"
                                      target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:lorentedford@gmail.com">lorentedford@gmail.com</a></a></div>
                                  <div style="font-size:small">Email: <a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:KC9ZHV@KC9ZHV.com"
                                      target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:KC9ZHV@KC9ZHV.com">KC9ZHV@KC9ZHV.com</a></a></div>
                                  <div
                                    style="font-size:small;font-family:arial"><a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://www.lorentedford.com"
                                      target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.lorentedford.com">http://www.lorentedford.com</a></a></div>
                                  <div
                                    style="font-size:small;font-family:arial"><a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://www.kc9zhv.com"
                                      target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.kc9zhv.com">http://www.kc9zhv.com</a></a></div>
                                  <div
                                    style="font-size:small;font-family:arial"><a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://forum.kc9zhv.com"
                                      target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://forum.kc9zhv.com">http://forum.kc9zhv.com</a></a></div>
                                  <div
                                    style="font-size:small;font-family:arial"><a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://hub.kc9zhv.com"
                                      target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://hub.kc9zhv.com">http://hub.kc9zhv.com</a></a></div>
                                  <div style="font-size:small"><a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://ltcraft.net/"
                                      style="color:rgb(17,85,204)"
                                      target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://Ltcraft.net">http://Ltcraft.net</a><span></span><span></span></a></div>
                                </div>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <br>
                            <div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jul 11,
                              2016 at 1:05 PM, Steve Zingman <span
                                dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  href="mailto:szingman@msgstor.com"
                                  target="_blank">szingman@msgstor.com</a>></span>
                              wrote:<br>
                              <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                                style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                                <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
                                  It's going to taker a LOT of work to
                                  change versions of Asterisk. That's
                                  not to say it will not happen.<br>
                                  I can't re-create you crashes.<br>
                                  I firewall my boxes to only allow
                                  access from trusted addresses for ssh.
                                  I use a VPN for roaming users. I don't
                                  support SIP.
                                  <div>
                                    <div><br>
                                      <br>
                                      <div>On 7/11/2016 2:02 PM, Loren
                                        Tedford wrote:<br>
                                      </div>
                                      <blockquote type="cite">
                                        <p dir="ltr">I suppose while we
                                          are stepping on toes I want to
                                          ask about the proper way of
                                          securing a dial box from our
                                          wonderful hackers out their..
                                          Been using ufw and fail2ban
                                          but found out recently nothing
                                          is invincible.. any thoughts??
                                          By the way any progress on
                                          asterisk crashes?? I can't
                                          find a reason for the crashes
                                          in the logs..<br>
                                        </p>
                                        <p dir="ltr">Also what is the
                                          status on updating asterisk to
                                          a more current version?? Any
                                          issues with that?? <br>
                                          <br>
                                        </p>
                                        <p dir="ltr">Loren Tedford
                                          (KC9ZHV) <br>
                                          Email: <a
                                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                                            href="mailto:lorentedford@gmail.com"
                                            target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:lorentedford@gmail.com">lorentedford@gmail.com</a></a><br>
                                          Phone: <br>
                                          Fax: <br>
                                          <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                            href="http://www.lorentedford.com"
                                            target="_blank">http://www.lorentedford.com</a><br>
                                          <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                            href="http://kc9zhv.com"
                                            target="_blank">http://kc9zhv.com</a></p>
                                        <p dir="ltr">Sent from Droid
                                          Turbo from Verizon wireless
                                          network</p>
                                        <div class="gmail_quote">On Jul
                                          11, 2016 12:34 PM, "Steve
                                          Zingman" <<a
                                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                                            href="mailto:szingman@msgstor.com"
                                            target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:szingman@msgstor.com">szingman@msgstor.com</a></a>>

                                          wrote:<br type="attribution">
                                          <blockquote
                                            class="gmail_quote"
                                            style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                                            <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"
                                              text="#000000"> Yes,<br>
                                              I've seen it before.
                                              Ramesh asked the question
                                              here and a couple of us
                                              had some questions as to
                                              his configuration. I think
                                              he is in process of
                                              gathering info so we can
                                              trouble shoot more.<br>
                                              I't not hard to get lists
                                              confused.<br>
                                              <br>
                                              Steve<br>
                                              <br>
                                              <div>On 7/11/2016 1:30 PM,
                                                DuaneVT . wrote:<br>
                                              </div>
                                              <blockquote type="cite">
                                                <div dir="ltr">
                                                  <div>Thanks Steve. You
                                                    have helped me
                                                    several times here I
                                                    believe. Perhaps it
                                                    was the ARM Allstar
                                                    list I should have
                                                    ranted to. As some
                                                    posts get shared
                                                    between lists, it is
                                                    hard not to end up
                                                    on another list.  </div>
                                                  <div>Here is an
                                                    example. I felt for
                                                    the questioner...</div>
                                                  <div>"<span
                                                      style="font-size:15px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">Message:



                                                      3</span></div>
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">Date:
                                                    Sun, 10 Jul 2016
                                                    09:53:39 -0400</span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">From:
                                                    Doug Crompton <</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:doug@crompton.com" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:doug@crompton.com">doug@crompton.com</a></a><span
style="font-size:15px">></span><br style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">To:
                                                    ARM Allstar <</span><a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:arm-allstar@hamvoip.org"
                                                    target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:arm-allstar@hamvoip.org">arm-allstar@hamvoip.org</a></a><span
style="font-size:15px">></span><br style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">Subject:

                                                    Re: [arm-allstar]
                                                    Using "A" and "B"
                                                    audio outputs using
                                                    the</span><br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px"> 
                                                          DIAL Image on
                                                    a RPi</span><br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">Message-ID:

                                                    <BLU171-</span><span
style="font-size:15px">W25439CF444D3509E8F7BE5BA3E0@</span><span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">phx.gbl></span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">Content-Type:

                                                    text/plain;
                                                    charset="iso-8859-1"</span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">Ramesh,</span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px"> This
                                                    is NOT a dial list,
                                                    ask elsewhere! It
                                                    works fine on the </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://hamvoip.org/" rel="noreferrer"
                                                    style="font-size:15px"
                                                    target="_blank">hamvoip.org</a><span
style="font-size:15px"> code.</span><br style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">73
                                                    Doug</span><br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">WA3DSP</span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <a
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.crompton.com/hamradio" rel="noreferrer"
                                                    style="font-size:15px"
                                                    target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.crompton.com/hamradio">http://www.crompton.com/hamradio</a></a><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    To: </span><a
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:arm-allstar@hamvoip.org" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:arm-allstar@hamvoip.org">arm-allstar@hamvoip.org</a></a><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    Date: Sun, 10 Jul
                                                    2016 07:34:57 -0400</span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>

                                                    Subject:
                                                    [arm-allstar] Using
                                                    "A" and "B" audio
                                                    outputs using the
                                                    DIAL Image   on a
                                                    RPi</span><br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    From: </span><a
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:arm-allstar@hamvoip.org" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:arm-allstar@hamvoip.org">arm-allstar@hamvoip.org</a></a><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    CC: </span><a
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Ramesh@va3uv.com" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Ramesh@va3uv.com">Ramesh@va3uv.com</a></a><br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">></span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    Hi All:</span><br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">></span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    I am using the DIAL
                                                    Image on a PRi 2; I
                                                    would like to use
                                                    the "A" and</span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    "B" audio outputs
                                                    from my fob (A for
                                                    voice and B for PL),
                                                    so that I can</span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    inject them into
                                                    separate points on
                                                    my exciter.</span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">></span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    I was able to get 2
                                                    'discrete' audio
                                                    outputs when running
                                                    ACID on a PC.</span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    This doesn't seem to
                                                    be working with the
                                                    Pi / DIAL.  Is
                                                    anyone running</span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    this configuration
                                                    on a Pi?</span><br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">></span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    Thx,</span><br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">></span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>

                                                    Ramesh.</span><br
                                                    style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">></span><br
style="font-size:15px">
                                                  <span
                                                    style="font-size:15px">>
                                                    # 27919 and a truck
                                                    load of others!
                                                    <div>​"</div>
                                                  </span>
                                                  <div><span
                                                      style="font-size:15px">
                                                      <div><br>
                                                      </div>
                                                    </span></div>
                                                  <div><span
                                                      style="font-size:15px">
                                                      <div>Sheesh, I
                                                        want to help
                                                        everyone....</div>
                                                    </span></div>
                                                  <div><span
                                                      style="font-size:15px">
                                                      <div>Thanks again
                                                        until my next
                                                        question HERE,</div>
                                                    </span></div>
                                                  <div><span
                                                      style="font-size:15px">
                                                      <div>Duane ​</div>
                                                    </span></div>
                                                </div>
                                                <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                                                  <div
                                                    class="gmail_quote">On
                                                    Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at
                                                    1:06 PM, Steve
                                                    Zingman <span
                                                      dir="ltr"><<a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:szingman@msgstor.com" target="_blank"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:szingman@msgstor.com">szingman@msgstor.com</a></a>></span>
                                                    wrote:<br>
                                                    <blockquote
                                                      class="gmail_quote"
                                                      style="margin:0px
                                                      0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                                                      <div
                                                        bgcolor="#FFFFFF"
                                                        text="#000000">
                                                        Duane,<br>
                                                        When were you
                                                        told on the
                                                        App_rpt-users
                                                        list to go
                                                        elsewhere with
                                                        DIAL questions?
                                                        DIAL is the
                                                        official
                                                        distribution for
                                                        AllStar. Support
                                                        questions SHOULD
                                                        be posted here.
                                                        I know that
                                                        other lists
                                                        limit their
                                                        support to THEIR
                                                        distribution and
                                                        have curtly told
                                                        DIAL users to go
                                                        elsewhere for
                                                        support. I do
                                                        not remember
                                                        seeing your
                                                        question on
                                                        here. If I
                                                        missed it, I'm
                                                        sorry. I TRY to
                                                        help out with
                                                        DIAL and general
                                                        Asterisk
                                                        questions when
                                                        possible.<br>
                                                        <br>
                                                        73, Steve N4IRS<br>
                                                        INAD <br>
                                                        <br>
                                                        <div>On
                                                          7/11/2016
                                                          12:42 PM,
                                                          DuaneVT .
                                                          wrote:<br>
                                                        </div>
                                                        <blockquote
                                                          type="cite">
                                                          <div dir="ltr">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="font-family:"comic
                                                          sans
                                                          ms",sans-serif;font-size:small">I
                                                          too have asked
                                                          questions here
                                                          concerning
                                                          DIAL and been
                                                          told curtly to
                                                          go elsewhere.
                                                          As DIAL
                                                          distros have
                                                          all the files
                                                          included and
                                                          interface to
                                                          the FOBs and
                                                          SBCs, where do
                                                          we draw the
                                                          line? I have
                                                          followed all
                                                          instructions
                                                          for installing
                                                          the software
                                                          and had fresh
                                                          boot problems.
                                                          It was hard to
                                                          tell where the
                                                          problem was,
                                                          but when I am
                                                          new to
                                                          Linux/DIAL and
                                                          the whole
                                                          Allstar
                                                          project, I
                                                          looked for
                                                          guidance where
                                                          I found
                                                          discussions.
                                                          There is an
                                                          Allstar Link
                                                          community on
                                                          Google+, and
                                                          you will see I
                                                          have all
                                                          except 1
                                                          postings!
                                                          Crickets.........</div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="font-family:"comic
                                                          sans
                                                          ms",sans-serif;font-size:small">Perhaps

                                                          the
                                                          moderator/users
                                                          here could
                                                          post a list of
                                                          URLs for
                                                          different
                                                          aspects of
                                                          AllStar Link
                                                          so us Newbies
                                                          would know
                                                          where to hang
                                                          out.</div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="font-family:"comic
                                                          sans
                                                          ms",sans-serif;font-size:small">I
                                                          have had GREAT
                                                          support from
                                                          other listers
                                                          here by direct
                                                          email after
                                                          each post and
                                                          I sincerely
                                                          thank all who
                                                          have taken an
                                                          interest in
                                                          someone who
                                                          has to learn
                                                          as we all do.</div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="font-family:"comic
                                                          sans
                                                          ms",sans-serif;font-size:small">73,</div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="font-family:"comic
                                                          sans
                                                          ms",sans-serif;font-size:small">Duane

                                                           KA1LM  #42996</div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <fieldset></fieldset>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <pre>_______________________________________________
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                                                          <span><font
                                                          color="#888888">
                                                          </font></span></blockquote>
                                                        <span><font
                                                          color="#888888">
                                                          <br>
                                                          <pre cols="72">-- 
"Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about."
1st Law of Logic
</pre>
                                                          </font></span></div>
                                                    </blockquote>
                                                  </div>
                                                  <br>
                                                </div>
                                              </blockquote>
                                              <br>
                                              <pre cols="72">-- 
"Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about."
1st Law of Logic
</pre>
                                            </div>
                                            <br>
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                                        </div>
                                      </blockquote>
                                      <br>
                                      <pre cols="72">-- 
"Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about."
1st Law of Logic
</pre>
                                    </div>
                                  </div>
                                </div>
                              </blockquote>
                            </div>
                            <br>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                      </blockquote>
                      <br>
                      <pre cols="72">-- 
"Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about."
1st Law of Logic
</pre>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                </div>
              </blockquote>
            </div>
            <br>
          </div>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- 
"Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about."
1st Law of Logic
</pre>
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